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Alan Greveson's World War I Forum (Page 128)

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Posted by: Brosie {Email left}
Location: Arbroath
Date: Sunday 17th October 2010 at 9:09 PM
Hello Alan,
Hoping for any information about my grandmother's half brother.
John Robertson,born Paisley Renfrewshire about 1894.
No 655985, 7th Indian division ammunition column, royal field artillery driver.
died 25th october 1918, buried Beiruit war cemetery memorial reference 11.
The word died as opposed to killed is one question Alan ?.
The other one is John's age is unknown, was this usual in ww1.
Regards Brosie.
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Monday 18th October 2010 at 12:50 PM

Dear Brosie,
It was never the role of a Graves Registration Unit and later the Imperial War Graves Commission (now CWGC) to record biographical details of a service person. Their role was to identify the burial place of each soldier and, after December 1915, provide a permanent grave. The Forces identified an individual by his surname, initials, rank, number and regiment. So war graves are recorded in the same way the military would have recorded an individual. In the 1920s when the war grave cemeteries were being created the CWGC wrote to soldiers' families and asked if they wished to record any further details. Some families did; others didn't. Some letters went unanswered. Perhaps one in five CWGC entries includes some biographical detail. Where a soldier is shown as "age unknown" it doesn't mean his age was unknown. It means the CWGC was not told his age.

The expression "died" was specific. It meant a soldier's death was not directly caused by enemy action. Deaths caused by enemy action were recorded as "killed in action" or if the soldier had reached medical care, "died of wounds". The expression "died" implied death by disease, sickness or accident. In the case of John Robinson buried in Beirut it almost certainly implied he had been in hospital in Beirut and had probably died of sickness such as malaria.
The CWGC Debt of Honour recorded that Driver John Robertson, 655985, RFA was serving with the 7th Indian Division Ammunition Column when he died. The evidence is that he served with the 1st/2nd Lowland Brigade from 1916 and his artillery brigade joined the 7th (Meerut) Division in April 1918 in Egypt.

No service record appears to have survived for this John Robertson. A Medal Rolls Index Card for John Robertson showed his original regimental number was 8325 with the RFA. His number was changed to 655985 with the RFA. This is indicative of the re-numbering of the Territorial Force in March 1917 when all T.F. soldiers were allotted new six-figure numbers as part of a general re-organisation. This indicated that whichever unit John was serving in it had originally existed before the war as a Territorial Force unit. John qualified for the British War Medal and the Victory Medal but not the 1914-15 Star for service abroad before December 31st 1915. Therefore he did not serve abroad until after January 1st 1916. He was therefore probably part of a draft of reinforcements.
His new number, 655985 was in a series allotted to the 2nd Lowland Brigade Royal Artillery and the 2nd/2nd Lowland Brigade including 261 Brigade RA and 326 Brigade RA. The latter served at home and in Ireland, therefore going by the number alone, it would appear John served with the 261 Brigade Royal Artillery which supported the infantry of the army's 52nd (Lowland) Division. The Artillery used Roman numerals to designate their brigades, so the unit was the CCLXI (II Lowland) Brigade Royal Field Artillery which served with the 52nd Division. The II (2nd) Lowland artillery brigade had batteries originally from Irvine, Kilmarnock and Kirkcudbright, with the Lowland Divisional Ammunition Column from Ardrossan.
The 52nd Division moved to Gallipoli via Egypt in June 1915, but the artillery remained in Egypt. The Lowland Division itself returned to Egypt in January 1916 and moved to El Kantara and on 2 March took over as section of the Suez Canal defences. At some stage in 1916 John Robertson joined the Lowland Division's artillery in Egypt. The Division then took part in the Palestine Campaign, fighting at Dueidar on April 22nd 1916 and the Battle of Romani on August 4th and 5th 1916. They then fought at Gaza in the Second Battle of Gaza on 17th and 19th April 1917 and the Third Battle of Gaza in the first week of November 1917. They were engaged at Wadi el Hesi on November 8th 1917; the capture of Junction Station (14 November); the Battle of Nabi Samweil (20 - 24 November) and the Battle of Jaffa (21-22 December) including the passage of the Nahr-el-Auja .
The Division remained in the line near Arsuf until March 1918 when orders were received on 24 March that the Division would be relieved by the 7th (Meerut) Division and the Lowland Division would be sent to France.

However, a decision was made to keep the Lowland Division's artillery in the Middle East and transfer it to the 7th (Meerut) Indian Division, whose own artillery would go to France with the Lowland Division. On April 8th the Scottish artillerymen joined the 7th Meerut Division with John Robertson serving in the Divisional Ammunition Column (DAC). The DAC provided the transport and delivery of all ammunition between the ammunition dumps and the front line. During the summer of 1918 the 7th (Meerut) Division captured the 'North Sister' and 'South Sister' Hills on 8th June 1918 and raided 'Piffer Ridge' on 27th June 1918. It subsequently took part in General Edmund Allenby's advance through Palestine, including the Battle of Megiddo from 19 September to 1 October 1918, and its subsequent exploitation which was the culminating victory in General Allenby's campaign in Palestine .
Beirut was occupied by the 7th (Meerut) Division on 8 October 1918 when French warships were already in the harbour, and the 32nd and 15th Combined Clearing Hospitals were set up in the town.
John Roberston died on October 25th 1918 and is buried in grave 11 at the Beirut War Cemetery. See
http://www.cwgc.org/CWGCImgs/Beirut%20War%20Cem%20%281939-45%29.jpg
As this history is based on interpreting his regimental number, any mistakes are entirely mine.
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Brosie
Date: Monday 18th October 2010 at 9:24 PM

Hello Alan,
Many thanks for your detailed reply to my questions about John Robertson, I have more
information than I hoped for thanks to yourself.

Although my Gran was his next of kin, according to my father www1 was never brought up
in any conversation in the house and the medals belonging to John were kept in a drawer.
Many many thanks .
Brosie.




Posted by: Lorraine Zima {Email left}
Location: Hempnall Norwich
Date: Sunday 17th October 2010 at 5:47 PM
Hello there,
I have just spent hours reading your fabulous site and posts, and wonder if you could kindly help me at all please? My father, Gilbert Ernest Theobald (War record no 5834911) was in the 2nd Battallion of the Suffolk Regiment, and I have recently discovered letters that he wrote from "India Command". It had always been my understanding he was a "Chindit" - who I understood fought behind enemy lines in Burma. But this doesnt tie up with the letters! Would you be able to help me shed any light on exactly where my father served and when? His date of birth was 30.12.1921 and he died in November 1995, but in all the years of my growing up he would never talk of his war time experiences. I know he spent some time in hospital in a place called Trimulgherry Deccan where he suffered from malaria and jaundice.
I believe you can obtain copies of a soldier's actual war record and wondered if this would be able to help me?
Many thanks in advance for your kind assistance.
Lorraine Zima (nee Theobald)
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Sunday 17th October 2010 at 9:03 PM

Dear Lorraine,
I am pleased you have found the website interesting. The service record of Gilbert Ernest Theobald will be held by the UK Ministry of Defence so you would need to apply for it as that is the starting point for primary evidence of his service. .
The 2nd Battalion Suffolk Regiment did serve in Burma with British and Allied Land Forces, South East Asia. Their war diaries are held at the National Archives at Kew in Catalogue series WO 172 and span the years 1939 to 1945 in six sub-series references: WO 172/312 (1939); WO 172/889 (1942); WO 172/2549 (1943); WO 172/4922 (1944) and WO 172/7667 (1945). By February 1946 they were at Lahore.
The order of battle of the two Chindit expeditions of 1943 and 1944 can be seen at:
http://www.chindits.info/Units/Units.html

It does not include the Suffolk Regiment, however that does not preclude an individual being attached to another unit, therefore it will be necessary to see Gilbert's service record.

The MoD will release certain amounts of information depending on whether you are next of kin or not. You can apply using the forms for next of kin, or with permission of next of kin, or as a general enquirer. See:
http://www.veterans-uk.info/service_records/service_records.html
You may need proof of death; date of birth; next of kin's permission unless you are the direct next of kin; a cheque and completed forms Part 1 and 2. The next of kin form (Part 1) is for completion by the next of kin of deceased service personnel (or enquirers with the consent of next of kin). Look for "Service records publications" under "Related pages" and follow the instructions. The Part 2 form is entitled: "Request forms for service personnel Army" found under "Related Pages". A cheque for GBP 30 should be made payable to "The MoD Accounting Officer" and sent to Army Personnel Centre Secretariat, Disclosures 2, Mail Point 515, Kentigern House, 65 Brown Street, Glasgow G2 8EX Scotland with all the paperwork.
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Leah Kausman
Date: Monday 18th October 2010 at 2:09 AM

How do I contact Alan Greveson? I am researching ancestry and may have a relative who died in WW1.
He served in the Lancashire Fusiliers 1914-1920.
Reply from: Lorraine
Date: Wednesday 27th October 2010 at 8:39 PM

Dear Alan
Thank you so much for pointing me in the right direction! I have gotten the forms from MOD and sent them off with required details.

Just looking forward now to getting Dad's complete war record and filling in some of the gaps.

With many thanks and best regards
Lorraine


Posted by: Lorraine Wolfe {Email left}
Location: Wakefield
Date: Sunday 17th October 2010 at 1:16 PM
I am trying to find any information on John Thomas Luby private 13896 7th battalion koyli he was killed in france on 09/11/1915 we know where his grave is which my father has recently visited but would really like a photograph of him if anyone could help us with this
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Sunday 17th October 2010 at 8:21 PM

Dear Lorraine,
No service record has survived for John Thomas Luby of the KOYLI so it is not possible to give a detailed account of his time in the war. "Soldiers Died in the Great War" (HMSO 1921) recorded that he was born in Holbeck, Leeds and was killed in action while with the 7th Battalion KOYLI. The CWGC Debt of Honour also recorded that he was with the 7th Battalion KOYLI. These records showed the battalion he was with when he died. It is likely, but not certain, he served with the same battalion throughout.
The 7th Battalion KOYLI was a "war service" battalion raised at Pontefract on 12th September 1914 as part of Kitchener's Second New Army. The new battalion trained at Woking and moved to Witley, near Aldershot, in February 1915. It May 1915 it moved to Salisbury Plain and trained with the 61st Infantry Brigade in the 20th Division. The Division was inspected by King George V at Knighton Down on 24 June 1915, by which time it was ready for war. It was also visited by Lord Kitchener.
A Medal Rolls Index Card for John T Luby showed he entered France on 22nd July 1915, a date which matches that of the 7th Battalion KOYLI. The Battalion landed at Boulogne and marched to Steenwerck by the 29th when they took part in trench familiarisation near Armentieres attached to the 80th Infantry Brigade. The battalion suffered its first casualties on August 6th 1915 and after two weeks' training in trench routine it took over its own line of trenches in the Laventie sector, three miles north of Neuve Chapelle. The battalion played a minor role in the Battle of Loos in September and then settled into trench routine at Fleurbaix. John Luby was killed on 9th November 1915 which in general was a "quiet" period in this area and it is possible he was a casualty of the daily exchange of shelling and rifle fire.
After the War his family subscribed to "The National Roll of the Great War" and the entry for J.T. Luby of the KOYLI read: "Volunteering in September 1914 he was soon drafted to France and took part in much severe fighting in various sectors. He gave his life for King and Country on November 9th 1915 and was entitled to the 1914-15 Star, The General Service [British War] and Victory medals. "A valiant soldier with undaunted heart he breasted life's last hill." 16 Dudley Street, Holbeck, Leeds." ("National Roll of the Great War" Vol VIII, Page 206).

The most likely source for published photographs would be the local newspapers of the time which may have reported his death. They will be available at the Leeds local studies library. See:
http://www.culture24.org.uk/am11119
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Lorraine Wolfe
Date: Monday 18th October 2010 at 8:52 AM

Dear Alan,Thank you very much for your quick reply.I will look at the Leeds local studies library .Thank you.Lorraine


Posted by: Lynn {Email left}
Location: Anglesey
Date: Saturday 16th October 2010 at 5:38 PM
Hi
I am trying to find out what my grandfather did in the first world war.
His name is FRANCIS. E. HEALEY on his medel card it states that he was in the MACHINE GUN CORPS his rank was PRIVATE regtl. No. 62831.
I pressume he enlisted in Burnley Lancashire,
He survived the war and in the village church of Newchurch-in-Pendle there is a paque to all that served in the war and on it it states that he was a Coporal .Would he have been promoted after his medel card was written.?
If anyone can give me any help and information on what my Grandfather did and where he was in the war, I would be very grateful

Thankyou

Lynn
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Saturday 16th October 2010 at 7:40 PM

Dear Lynn,
Without knowing which company or battalion of the Machine Gun Corps Francis Healey served with it is not possible to suggest where he was during the war. No service record appears to have survived for him. His medal index card showed he qualified for the British War Medal and the Victory Medal but not the 1914-15 Star for service abroad before December 31st 1915. Therefore he served abroad after January 1st 1916. The medal roll containing a one-line entry for his service is MGC/101 B43 page 3720 which can be seen at the National Archives at Kew. It may or may not indicate which unit he was with and his dates of service. It is in Catalogue reference WO 329/1746 "Machine Gun Corps other ranks; Medal Rolls MGC/101B42; MGC/101B43; MGC/101B44; MGC/101B45; MGC/101B46; Pages 3625-3926. British War Medal and Victory Medal."
A plaque at St Mary's Church, Newport in Pendle, listing those who served in the war has been transcribed as showing Sgt Francis E Healey (http://www.eastlancsmemorials.co.uk/pendle/newchurch.htm).
His medal card wouldn't necessarily record any later promotions.
Kind regards,
Alan


Posted by: Sally
Location: Kent Uk
Date: Saturday 16th October 2010 at 8:39 AM
Hi
i was hoping that you could help me or point me in the right direction.
my uncle has brought a clock and on this clock it says that it was presented to a Major E R D palmer mcra by the nco's and men of the bengal rocket troop. i know he was married april 1951. apart from that i dont know any more

from sal
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Saturday 16th October 2010 at 5:29 PM

Dear Sal,
Major ERD Palmer MC RA (Military Cross, Royal Regiment of Artillery) was Edward Douglas Ronald Palmer, son of Lt-Col H D Palmer of Bexhill-on-Sea. He was known as Ronnie. He attended Winchester College (1929-34) and the Royal Military Academy in 1935. As a Gentleman Cadet he was commissioned into the Royal Artillery as a Second-Lieutenant on August 24th 1937 (London Gazette 27 August 1937 page 5442). He served with the British Expeditionary Force in 1939-40. He then served in the Middle East Force and the Central Mediterranean Force (CMF) - Italy and then in NW Europe 1943-45. He was promoted from Lieutenant to Captain in August 1944 and was awarded the Military Cross while in the rank of temporary Major in March 1945 (London Gazette 29 March 1945 page 1710) for "gallant and distinguished services in N W Europe". While a major, he married Vivian Crichton, the daughter of Lt-Col T C Crichton OBE MC in 1951. The forthcoming marriage announcement was made in January 1951 when the Crichton's were based at Wuppertal in Germany (The Times, Jan 16, 1951 page 6). After the war he was promoted to Colonel and held staff appointments at the War Office and in Germany until 1971("The Trusty Servant" Old Wykehamist News May 2004). In November 1960 he finished a term with the 402 (Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders) Light Regiment Royal Artillery (Territorial Army) at Dumbarton. He retired to Heyshott, West Sussex, and published an award-winning local history. He died on 27th February 2004. His wife appears to have been a local artist
The Bengal Rocket Troop of the Royal Artillery was an ancient title inherited by the 132 Battery R.A. and now held by 39 Regiment R.A. See:
http://www.army.mod.uk/artillery/units/39_regt_ra/default.aspx
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Sal
Date: Sunday 17th October 2010 at 3:04 PM

Hi alan
thank you ever so much. My uncle was over the moon to hear all this. i am now going to type this up so he can keep this information with his clock.

many thanks again

sally


Posted by: Lesley {Email left}
Location: Manchester
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 9:37 PM
Please can anybody give me info on my father ken toft great escape tom, dick, & harry stagluff 111

my dad was from galway eire when i google my dad he comes up as a canadian flight lieutentant no way he was irish ! i would like somebody to come up with his full name then i know for sure we are discussing the same person.


Posted by: John
Location: Camb S
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 7:26 PM
Hello Alan
last week you helped me with a research on my Gt uncle Ernest Favell,
I wondered if you could help again with another family member his name
is Cyril Frederic Baker the C.W.G. details show that he was Gunner 103147
in the Royal Field Artillery he died on 16th October 1916 thankyou
Regards John
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 10:05 PM

Dear John,
No individual service record appears to have survived for Cyril Frederick Baker. However, enough evidence has survived to draw some conclusions about his war service. An Army Medal Rolls Index card showed he qualified for the British War Medal and the Victory Medal but not the 1914-15 Star for service abroad before December 31st 1915. Therefore, he did not serve abroad until after January 1st 1916. The card showed he died on October 16th 1916.
The CWGC Debt of Honour recorded he was serving with the 86th Battery of the 14th Artillery Brigade of the Royal Field Artillery when he died. This Brigade was also known as the XIV Brigade as the Artillery used Roman numerals to designate their brigades. The 86th Battery was a Howitzer Battery of the RFA and it joined the XIV Brigade in May 1916 attached to the Army's 4th Division.

The 86th Battery was a pre-war regular army battery of the XII (Howitzer) Brigade which was broken up on 12th May 1916. On May 18th 1916 the 86th Battery transferred to the XIV Artillery Brigade in the 4th Division. As Cyril did not go abroad until 1916, it would appear he was a trained recruit included in a draft of reinforcements when he went abroad. Given the short time-span before his death it is likely, but not certain, he served only with the 86th Battery.

His date of death coincided with the Battle of the Le Transloy Ridges which was one of the twelve individual battles on the Somme in 1916. In their major engagements, the 4th Division fought at the Battle of Albert on July 1st 1916 and at Le Transloy between October 1st and October 18th 1916 when the British tried to expand on their gains after occupying much of the Thiepval Ridge. The battle was fought in worsening weather and the battlefield conditions were very poor. The advance was not a success and fresh orders for further attacks on October 13th took little account of the state of the soldiers and the battlefield. The advance was called off on October 18th not least because of the accuracy of the enemy's artillery fire which would have been active against the British artillery. "Soldiers Died in the Great War" (HMSO 1921) recorded that Cyril was killed in action. He is commemorated on the Thiepval Memorial to the missing of the Somme. The "Missing" does include soldiers who were buried in known graves where the grave markers were subsequently destroyed and those buried as unidentified soldiers in Commonwealth War Graves.

If you can visit the National Archives at Kew, the war diary of the XIV Brigade RFA is held in Catalogue reference WO 95/1466 "14 Brigade Royal Field Artillery 4 Division Date: 1914 1916".

Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: John
Date: Saturday 16th October 2010 at 1:14 PM

Thankyou once again Alan for your help it will certainly help me with my family history
Kind Regards John


Posted by: Mick {Email left}
Location: Sheffield
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 12:22 PM
Hi,
i was wondering if you could find any information about a William H Howson, he was in the RFA in the 1st world war. His number is 1045804, i was told he got wounded, On his marriage certificate dated 1921 he was still in the army, i dont know if he joined the army before the war or when war broke out.

thanks mick
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 5:49 PM

Dear Mick,
As William Howson served after 1921 his service record would be still held by the UK Ministry of Defence. A First World War Medal Rolls Index card showed he qualified for the British War Medal and the Victory Medal with the wartime regimental number of 54117. As he did not qualify for the 1914-15 Star for service abroad before December 31st 1915, he did not serve abroad until after January 1st 1916. William also qualified for the General Service Medal with the clasp "Iraq" which was awarded for service in Iraq in 1920 during the rebellion there.
His qualification for the British War and Victory Medals is contained in the medal roll numbered RFA348B page 49956 which can only be seen at the National Archives. It will contain a one-line entry for William Howson which may give dates of service and his unit. It may not. The roll is in National Archives Catalogue reference WO 329/201 "Royal Field Artillery other ranks: medal rolls RFA/348B; RFA/349B. Pages 49910-50213. British War Medal and Victory Medal". His seven-digit number 1045804 would have been allotted in 1920 and became his permanent service number.
His service history may be retained by the MoD. The MoD will release certain amounts of information depending on whether you are next of kin or not. You can apply using the forms for next of kin, or with permission of next of kin, or as a general enquirer. See:
http://www.veterans-uk.info/service_records/service_records.html
You may need proof of death; date of birth; next of kin's permission unless you are the direct next of kin; a cheque and completed forms Part 1 and 2. The next of kin form (Part 1) is for completion by the next of kin (or enquirers with the consent of next of kin) of deceased service personnel. Look for "Service records publications" under "Related pages" and follow the instructions. The Part 2 form is entitled: "Request forms for service personnel Army" found under "Related Pages". A cheque for GBP 30 should be made payable to "The MoD Accounting Officer" and sent to Army Personnel Centre Secretariat, Disclosures 2, Mail Point 515, Kentigern House, 65 Brown Street, Glasgow G2 8EX Scotland with all the paperwork.
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Mick
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 7:41 PM

Thank you Alan for the information about William Howson.
Ive just come across his marriage certificate, it says he was in the 132nd Battery, 13th Brigade Royal Field Artillery. Upto now ive come across three of my family members who fought in the 1st world war, the other two are Private Harold Norton 143004, 25th Bn, Machine Gun Corps ( Infantry), he died aged 19 on the 14th April 1918 ( i dont know where or which battle he died in ),and is buried in the Lijssenthoek Military Cemetery. The third relative is Laurence Norton, he got shot in the leg by a german bullet in 1915, that's all i know about him.

thank you once again for the information

mick
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Saturday 16th October 2010 at 3:19 PM

Dear Mick,
The 13th Brigade (XIII Brigade) RFA was a regular army brigade of the British Army in India serving at first with the 7th (Meerut) Division in 1914 and then transferring to the 3rd (Lahore) Division which saw service during the war as part of the Indian Corps in France before being moved to Mesopotamia where it fought against troops of the Ottoman Empire. William Howson did not appear to have served abroad until after January 1st 1916.

Harold Norton, aged 19 in 1918, would probably have been conscripted into the army after reaching the age of 18 and one month. A Medal Rolls Index Card showed he enlisted in the South Staffordshire Regiment before being transferred to the Machine Gun Corps. When he died he was with the 25th Battalion Machine Gun Corps which was formed from four machine gun companies in March 1918 and served with the 25th Division. In March 1918 they fought on the Somme and were moved to Caestre on March 31st 1918 where a large number of new recruits, mainly 19 year olds, brought the Division back up to strength. By April 9th the Division was in the front line at Ploegsteert, between Armentieres and Ypres when the enemy attacked their positions (The Battle of Estaires). The next day, April 10th, the German Fourth Army advanced north of Armentieres capturing Messines and the 25th Division, outflanked on both sides, withdrew 4 kilometres. On April 11th, Haig issued his special order of the day: "There is no other course open to us but to fight it out. Every position must be held to the last man: there must be no retirement. With our backs to the wall and believing in the justice of our cause each one of us must fight on to the end. The safety of our homes and the Freedom of mankind alike depend upon the conduct of each one of us at this critical moment."
"Soldiers Died in the Great War" (HMSO 1921) recorded that Harold Norton, from Sheffield, "died of wounds" on 14th April 1918. That expression meant that he had reached medical care after being wounded. He was buried at Lijssenthoek which was the location of Field Ambulances on the road from Ypres to Poperinghe.

The CWGC Debt of Honour recorded Harold Norton's parents as Frederick and Ada of Sheffield. In the pre-war census Frederick and Ada were shown living at 348 London Road, Sheffield, with a family that included Harold, and a son Lawrence. Lawrence Norton was Harold's older brother. Lawrence was born in the autumn of 1896 (GRO Births Q4 1896 Ecclesall Bierlow Vol 9C Page 417). A Lawrence Norton who gave his address as 348 London Road, Sheffield, volunteered to join the Army on November 18th 1914. He stated he was a fork grinder, aged 19 years and two months. In fact he was aged 18. He was attested (sworn in) at the depot of the York and Lancaster Regiment which was affiliated to Sheffield and had its depot battalion at Pontefract where it shared the barracks with the King's Own Yorkshire Light Infantry. Lawrence was posted as a gunner to the Royal Garrison Artillery No 1 Coastal Depot at Newhaven and served with the 12th Company RGA until June 1915 when he transferred to the York and Lancaster Regiment with the regimental number 20548. Service in the RGA would have suited the needs of the time increasing the defence of the coast against the perceived threat of invasion. He was posted back to the Infantry from No 12 Company RGA which was based at Tynemouth. Lawrence was posted to the 2nd Battalion York and Lancaster Regiment which was serving in France with the 16th Infantry Brigade in the 6th Division. He arrived in France on 18th August 1915 just after the Battalion had fought at Hooge. Lawrence was wounded on an illegible date in September 1915 (2nd or 22nd? Sept). He suffered a gun-shot wound (rifle or shrapnel) in the left thigh which broke his femur. He was wounded at St Eloi, Flanders. See:
http://john-dillon.co.uk/yorklancs/hooge.html
Lawrence returned to England as a casualty on September 27th 1915 where he would have been treated for his wounds. He remained in the army until 23rd January 1917 when he was transferred to the reserves and was finally discharged on October 9th 1917. He qualified for the 1914-15 Star, the British War Medal and the Victory Medal. He was granted the Silver War Badge for being wounded.
A brief service record has survived. It can be viewed at the National Archives or downloaded from the Ancestry website (charges apply). Some libraries provide free access to the Ancestry website.
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Mick
Date: Saturday 23rd October 2010 at 1:45 PM

Thank you for your help, much appreciated

mick


Posted by: Bella Johnson
Location: Esher
Date: Sunday 10th October 2010 at 4:35 PM
My Grandfather served in the King's Liverpool Regiment Depot 1914-1920

Name: Francis (known as Frank) Johnson - Regimental No,50575 Private. Am trying to find out which battalion he was with and whether or not he served abroad and what was his role. Any information would be extremely appreciated.
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Wednesday 13th October 2010 at 6:10 PM

Dear Bella,
The depot battalion of the King's (Liverpool Regiment) was a training battalion which did not see overseas service. Many men passed through a training battalion but few would have remained in it throughout the war. Francis Johnson earned the British War Medal and the Victory Medal which could only be earned by service overseas (outside the UK). Therefore he must have served abroad, probably after being transferred to another battalion of The King's. Unfortunately there is no immediate evidence to show which battalion that was with.
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Bella Johnson
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 7:33 AM

Dear Alan,
Thank you so much for the information received on my Grandfather Francis Johnson. Can I pick your brain a little further.

How do I go about finding out where the battalion trained in the UK and what would be your suggestion for finding out further information, The Imperial War Museum?

Again many thanks and I shall be sending a donation to your charity.

Regards
Bella Johnson
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 11:24 AM

Dear Bella,
The 3rd Battalion The King's (Liverpool Regiment) was based at Seaforth, Liverpool prior to August 1914. At the outbreak of war it moved to Hightown on Liverpool Bay. In July 1915 it moved to Pembroke Dock which was a large garrison town in Wales. At the end of 1917 it moved to Cork, in Ireland until the end of the war.
The King's Regiment was amalgamated with other regiments in 1958 and 2006 and no longer exists. However, its heritage is continued with the present-day Duke of Lancaster's Regiment.
Museums do not hold service records of soldiers and so they are not the best starting point to establish in which battalion of a regiment a soldier served. The archives of The King's are held by the Archives Section of the Museum of Liverpool. Francis Johnson is in their online database but that does not indicate what information, if any, they hold. See:

http://www.liverpoolmuseums.org.uk/mol/history/citysoldiers/research/

You can search the "First World War database".
The King's Regiment Museum is now part of the newly-created Museum of Liverpool Life. See

http://www.armymuseums.org.uk/museums/0000000056-King-s-Regiment-Museum-Collection.htm

Various museums hold artefacts of the former regiments that constitute the Duke of Lancaster's regiment. They are shown at:

http://www.army.mod.uk/infantry/regiments/14894.aspx

Francis Johnson qualified for the Victory and the British War Medals. His qualification for these medals will be shown in a one-line entry on the regimental Medal Roll which can only be seen at the National Archives at Kew. The roll might indicate his dates of service or his battalion. It might not. The roll is numbered H/2/102B19 and his entry is on page 2164. This roll is in National Archives Catalogue reference WO 329/816 "Liverpool Regiment other ranks: medal rolls H/2/102B19; H/2/102B20; H/2/102B21. Pages 2122-2424. British War Medal and Victory Medal." Page 2164.
You can visit the National Archives at Kew or pay for the National Archives to see what it says. See

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/paid_research.htm

Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Bella Johnson
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 2:29 PM

Dear Alan,

Again, many thanks for your quick response to my enquiries. I have taken on board your suggestions and will continue the search.

Kind regards

Bella Johnson

PS Is there an equivalent of what you do for the Royal Navy? My other Grandfather signed on in 1881 for 10 years. I have his number and some details of the ships he sailed on, but wonder if a trip to the Royal Naval College, Greenwich would reveal more information.

,
Reply from: Bella Johnson
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 2:40 PM

Dear Alan,

Again many thanks for your quick response to my enquiries. I have taken on board your suggestions and will continue the search.

Is there an equivalent of what you do for the Royal Navy? My other Grandfather signed on in 1881 for 10 years. I have his name and number the the ships he sailed on. Would a trip to the Royal Naval College, Greenwich reveal anything?

Kind regards.

Bella Johnson
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Friday 15th October 2010 at 5:48 PM

Dear Bella,
For Navy records see

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/looking-for-person/royalnavyrating1853-1923.htm?WT.lp=rg-3124

For ships' histories see

http://www.naval-history.net/

Kind regards,
Alan


Posted by: Ken Kinsella {Email left}
Location: Kilkenny Ireland
Date: Sunday 10th October 2010 at 12:51 PM
Dear Alan,

I have unable to find any meaningful information on how the following doctor died, and I would be most grateful if you could assist me with any information?

Captain William Oswald Halpin, Royal Army Medical Corps, attached 4th (Queen's Own) Hussars.

Last Day in Action: He died of wounds in Caix Military Hospital on 10 August 1918, age 31.

Military Notes:
Official War Diary for 10 August 1918 at Caix and Caylux:

Marched back between Caix and Caylux then up to Warvillers. Bivouacked one mile from Warvillers. Ten days before he died there was an epidemic of fever and the Divisional Commander congratulated the regiment on being in better health that any other regiment in the Division.

He enlisted in 1914 and was promoted Captain in 1915. In August 1914 the 4th (Queen's Own) Hussars were in Dublin, part of 3rd Cavalry Brigade in Cavalry Division. It moved to France. On 6 September 1914 the Brigade transferred to Gough's Command, and on 13 September 1914 it was renamed as 2nd Cavalry Division.

Family Information:
He was the son of Dr. William Oswald Halpin M.D. and Anna Maria Halpin of 'The Laurels,' Torquay Road, Foxrock, Co. Dublin. There were two children in the family; George and William Oswald.

Kindest regards,

Ken.
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Sunday 10th October 2010 at 8:11 PM

Dear Ken,
It's good to hear from you again. I see you are still hard at it and with another illustrious family.
William Oswald Halpin BA MD MB B CH BA O attended Trinity College Dublin and was commissioned into the RAMC on 10th August 1914. See
http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/28873/pages/6498/page.pdf
He was attached to the 4th (Queen's Own) Hussars as the Regimental Medical Officer. See:
http://www.ramc-ww1.com/profile.php?profile_id=11212
According to the Irish historian Turtle Bunbury in Dublin, "He died aged 31 of wounds received near Caix, France, on 10th August 1918, the day after a hostile aeroplane dropped a bomb on the regimental headquarters of the 4th (Queens Own) Hussars with whom he was working. He is buried at the Villers-Bretonneux Military Cemetery near Ameins in France." See:
http://www.turtlebunbury.com/published/published_books/docklands/north_wall/pub_books_docklands_halpin.html

Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Ken Kinsella
Date: Monday 11th October 2010 at 7:27 PM

Dear Alan,

Thank you, once again, for your kind assistance with important information relating to officers from south Co. Dublin who fell in the Great War. I am especially happy with the family history of the Halpin family of Foxrock.

Forever grateful;

My best wishes,

Ken.


Posted by: Ellen
Location: Brigg
Date: Saturday 9th October 2010 at 3:56 PM
Hi,
My Grandfather Robert Collings, was born in Norfolk (Kenninghall) and served in the Norfolk Regiment out in Gallipoli in the First World War. I remember my later mother tellling us stories that he was wounded in service - presumed dead, but as his CO went to pay his last respects noticed my Grandfather was breathing. He survived and was put on a troop train (somewhere, but know no details) and this train was then blown up. My eldest son has the wallet which Grandfather carried in his pocket and was said to have saved his life (it stopped the bullet going through him). I believe this story was covered by a newspaper somewhere, but hope it has not been too embellished over the years when being recounted to us as children. Grandfather was also, we were led to believe, in the first tank dvision, as the tank was being developed in Lincolnshire. Again we have no evidence of this and cannot find any mention of this anywhere. A little help would be greatly appreciated for his grandchildren and great grandchildren to chase his military carerr.
Regards.
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Sunday 10th October 2010 at 7:04 PM

Dear Ellen,
No service record has survived for Robert Collings of the Norfolk Regiment so it is not possible to provide a detailed history.
A Medal Rolls Index Card showed he served with the 4th Bn Norfolk Regiment with the regimental number 1736 and entered a theatre of war on 12th August 1915 in the Balkans. This matches the record of the 4th Battalion which was recorded as landing at Suvla Bay, Gallipoli on August 10th 1915. They left Gallipoli in December 1915 and went to Egypt and then Palestine. The medal card also indicated he served with the Tank Corps, with the regimental number 93005. This provides evidence that he transferred to the Tank Corps, but does not indicate when or where.
If the story was reported in the paper it may have been the local newspaper for the town in which he lived. These may be available to search at the Norfolk Local Studies Centre. See:
http://www.norfolk.gov.uk/Leisure_and_culture/Libraries/Local_studies/Norfolk_Heritage_Centre/
The war diary of the 4th Battalion in Gallipoli is available to download from the National Archives documents online website for GBP 3-50. It is Catalogue reference WO 95/4325 "1914 Aug. - 1915 Dec. / 163 Infantry Brigade: 1/4 Battalion Norfolk Regiment. 1915 July - Dec. /163 Infantry Brigade: 1/5 Battalion Norfolk Regiment. 1915 July - Dec. / 163 Infantry Brigade: 1/5 Battalion Suffolk Regiment. 1915 July - Dec. / Date: 1914 1922" . See:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/
It is not possible to say from the medal card which unit of the Tank Corps he served with.
Medal cards are available from the National Archives website (GBP 2-00) or the Ancestry website (charges apply). Your local library may provide free access to Ancestry.
Kind regards,
Alan


Posted by: Alan Edge {Email left}
Location: Leeds England
Date: Saturday 9th October 2010 at 11:39 AM
Hi I have been trying to research my wifes grandfather, his name was Patrick Scanlon,We belive through looking on internet that his number was 4776 and was discharged on 11/3/1919 we belive initialy he was in the 5th DAC rank cpl driver, and then possibly transfered to the Royal Irish Rifles and then Royal Irish Fusiliers I have seen a medal card for him ( i think )his number after the transfer being 20770 his transfer date is 23/6/1915.
Also I think we have details of a pension record, giving date of enlistment as 4/9/1908, disbility GSW left hand (this my father in law remembers he did not like anything or anyone messing with his left hand) date of origin 10/4/1918.
the dac thing is also brought to mind as again my father in law remembers his while watching a John Wayne film, how he said he used to ride 2 horses standing on top of their backs when in the army, he would not talk about the war.
he also remembers people refering to him as Sgt Major in the street.

Iknow this is a bit all over the place as facts go, but I would love to be able to give my father in law some facts

can anyone help...
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Saturday 9th October 2010 at 8:50 PM

Dear Alan,
The soldier you have identified declared his age on enlistment in 1908 as 17 years and six months (born March 1891). He said he was born at St John's Limerick (Army Form B 178). To be certain this is your wife's grandfather you would need to provide a genealogical burden of proof. The available military documents do not further identify this soldier.
The weight of evidence is that he did not serve with the Royal Irish Rifles. The only source for this information is the Medal Rolls Index card which had the hand-written entry R.I. Rifles No. 20770.
There are three other primary sources of evidence that show this man served with the Royal Irish Fusiliers No 20770.
The first is the medal roll indicated on the index card. This is roll number B/103 B8 page 826. This roll is held by the UK National Archives in Catalogue reference WO 329/1684 which refers to "Royal Irish Fusiliers (Princess Victoria's) other ranks; Medal Rolls B/103B6; B/103B7; B/103B8; B/103B9Pages 677-1014. British War Medal and Victory Medal".
The second is the medical board report card which was created in 1919 and showed he was with the Royal Irish Fusiliers. The third is the Army Form B178 which stated Royal Irish Fus 20770 and was signed by J H Conolly, Lieut. and stamped 3rd Reserve Battalion Royal Irish Fusiliers.
The conclusion is that the written entry on the medal index card was erroneous and should have read "Fusiliers". The 3rd battalion of any regiment was its depot battalion and would have administered records of soldiers who had been struck off the strength of their service battalion overseas. It is not an indication he served with the 3rd Battalion.
Patrick Scanlon served with the Royal Field Artillery No 4776 (AF B178) and was shown on his medal card as Driver 4776 5th DAC (Divisional Ammunition Column). He had later been promoted to Corporal and this rank was marked with an asterisk to match the asterisk next to RFA and his medal roll indicating the rank and regiment to be impressed on the medals. He transferred on 23 June 1915. That entry is non-specific and appears to indicate the transfer to the Royal Irish Fusiliers.
The other entries on the card indicate the date he entered a theatre of war (19 August 1914) to qualify for the 1914 Star. In August 1914 the theatre of war was France and Flanders. He was issued with the "clasp and roses" which was the Mons dated clasp and the emblem to be worn on the ribbon of the 1914 Star medal when only ribbons were worn. This indicated he had served under fire with the original British Expeditionary Force.
It therefore seems likely that he served with the RFA from 1908 to June 1915 and went to France with the 5th Divisional Ammunition Column at the outbreak of war. For a history of the 5th Division's engagements prior to June 1915 see:
http://www.1914-1918.net/5div.htm
Unfortunately there is no record of which battalion of the Royal Irish Fusiliers he served with so it is not possible to trace his history after June 1915, other than he was wounded in the hand in April 1918.
His medal card showed he was awarded the Silver War Badge (SWB List) for being wounded and he was discharged from the Army on 11th March 1919 under Kings Regulations paragraph 392 sub section xvi which covered men "no longer physically fit for service". An ex-regular would normally have been transferred to the reserve so his discharge under 392 xvi was to excuse him from further military service.
The medal rolls, shown on the medal card, are held at the National Archives and may show which battalion of the Royal Irish Fusiliers he served in.
Kind regards,
Alan


Posted by: Pete {Email left}
Location: East Yorkshire
Date: Friday 8th October 2010 at 8:54 PM
Dear Alan,
I would be very grateful if you could tell me anything about this soldier.
Lionel Walker 40027 Pte 2/5th and 3rd Lincs Regt. At some time he lived at 205 Convamore Road, Grimsby but I am not sure whether it was before or after his service.

With many thanks

Pete
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Saturday 9th October 2010 at 8:49 PM

Dear Pete,
No service record appears to have survived for Lionel Walker so it is not possible to give a detailed account of his service. His Medal Rolls Index card showed he qualified for the Victory and the British War medal, but not the 1914-15 Star for service abroad before December 31st 1915. Therefore he went abroad after January 1st 1916. He was awarded a Silver War Badge for leaving the army through wounds or sickness, but it is not known when that was awarded. The Medal Card shows his address as 205 Convamore Road because he returned his medals for re-stamping as they had apparently been impressed with the wrong details or spelling. This would have been in 1923 or 1924 so his address was probably a post-war address. The card showed he had the number 40027 in the Lincolnshire Regiment.
You say that he served in the 2/5th and the 3rd Battalions Lincolnshire Regiment. The 3rd Battalion was a home based training and depot battalion which was traditionally based at Lincoln but moved to Grimsby in August 1914 until early in 1918 when it moved to Cork. Service with the 3rd Battalion would either have been as a recruit on joining the Regiment or as an administrative depot after he had been wounded and taken off the strength of a fighting unit. A soldier being treated in hospital in the UK would be struck off the strength of his battalion in France and would come under the administration of the regiment's UK depot.
It therefore seems probable that Lionel's active service was with the 2nd/5th Battalion Lincolnshire Regiment.
In the pre-war census of Grimsby there was one Lionel Walker shown as the son of a widow, Arabell Walker of Orwell Street, Grimsby. His age was recorded as 17 and he was a fish house worker born at Hull. In the 1901 census this Lionel walker was shown as the son of Arabel Walker, widow, age nine born at Hull and living at Liverpool Street, Sculcoates. His birth appears to have been registered in the Jul-Aug-Sept quarter of 1891 at Sculcoates. This would have made him 23 at the outbreak of war.
The 2nd/5th Battalion Lincolnshire Regiment was raised at Grimsby on February 2nd 1915. It is plausible that Lionel served with them from their formation. The Battalion moved to St Albans in July 1915. In April 1916 it was sent to Ireland for security duties at Dublin and Fermoy. In January 1917 it returned to England with the 177th Infantry Brigade in the 59th Division at Fovant near Salisbury. In February 1917 the Division sailed for France. The 2nd/5th Battalion remained with the 59th Division until May 1918. The division's major engagements are shown at
http://www.1914-1918.net/59div.htm
Without a service record it is not possible to place Lionel within a timescale of the Battalion's activities.
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Pete
Date: Saturday 9th October 2010 at 10:58 PM

Once again my thanks for your help with this soldier. Although there is no service record, your details have confirmed to me that he is a member of the family I am researching.
I shall once again send a donation to your charity.

Kind regards

Pete


Posted by: Paul {Email left}
Location: Kent
Date: Friday 8th October 2010 at 2:21 PM
Dear Alan

My father is in his mid eighties and we have recently been making renewed efforts in trying to research his own father's experiences in the first war.

My Grandfather was Edward William Richards who joined the Kings Royal Rifle Corps in around November 1915 in Walworth, London, where he was assigned to the 20th (Pioneer) Battalion. His regimental number was C/9726. We believe that after arriving in France in the spring of 1916 he was on the Somme and apparently fought at Delville Wood. We understand (but don't know for sure) that he was gassed and also wounded (possibly twice) and was awarded the Military Medal as an acting sergeant which was listed in the London Gazette 13th December 1917. We think that he possibly served in the army of occupation in Germany after being commissioned and until he was demobbed in the spring of 1919. Unfortunately he suffered ill health in later life and rarely talked about the war which is why we would like to find out more.

We have visited the Royal Green Jackets museum in Winchester as we know KRRC merged with them in later years. They were most helpful but unfortunately could not throw any additional light on the subject. We also have a copy of the published history of the 20th Battalion KRRC (which we have found is also accessible in full on the internet) but whilst very interesting with regard to the battalion and their experiences, it does not help us in our search. We have been told that most of the records were destroyed during a bombing raid in the second world war and that we are unlikely to find any more information on his history.

I have, in the last few days, managed to find and purchase a copy of his Medal Card from the National Archive which shows he was commissioned as a 2nd Lieutenant on 26th June 1918, but in the Leicestershire Regiment which we knew nothing about as we thought he had served in the KRRC continuously. The Medal Card acknowledges the MM next to his name and has several different codes and numbers dotted around but does not identify the battalion or new service number that I believe he would have been issued with.

If you can throw any light on his experiences during his military career and the reason for the Military Medal, it would be very much appreciated indeed.

Thank you and kindest regards

Paul Richards
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Friday 8th October 2010 at 7:48 PM

Dear Paul,
You will need to visit the National Archives at Kew to find the additional information you are looking for. A soldier's service record will not give as much detailed information as a published history of the battalion. However, as he became an officer his service record is more likely to have survived as the bombing of the War Office repository is September 1940 destroyed soldiers' records, but had less impact on officer's records. See:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/looking-for-person/default.htm
and click on British Army Officers after 1913.
You may identify him in the online index, but the name Richards is common and it may be necessary to study the indexes at the TNA to see if a service record has survived.
The war diary of the 20th Bn KRRC is held at the National Archives in Catalogue reference WO 95/1405 "20 Battalion King's Royal Rifle Corps (Pioneers) 3 Division. Date: 1916 1918".
The award of the Military Medal was often about three months after the event in which it was earned. The award was published, without a citation, in the London Gazette Issue 30424 published on the 11 December 1917. Page 17 of 26: "His Majesty the KING has been graciously pleased to approve of -the award of the Military Medal for bravery in the Field to the undermentioned Noncommissioned Officers and Men: etc.
Edward William Richards was commissioned on June 16th 1918. "War Office, 29th July, 1918. REGULAR FORCES. The undermentioned cadets to be temp. 2nd Lts. 26 June 1918: Edward William Richards, M.M. (Supplement to the London Gazette of July 26th published on 29 July 1918 page 8981). He left the army on 12th October 1919: "Leic. R.Temp. 2nd Lt. E. W. Richards, M.M relinquishes his commission on completion of service, 12 Oct. 1919, and retains the rank of 2nd Lt." (Supplement to the London Gazette of 11 November 1919. Published 12th Nov 1919 page 13770). The Gazette can be searched online free of charge. See:
http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/search

To be commissioned, he would have spent about four months at an officer cadet school, probably in the UK, before joining the Leicestershire Regiment as a Second-lieutenant. So he would have left the KRRC in about March 1918.
His Medal Rolls Index card showed he entered France (Theatre of War (1)) in March 1916. The date the 20th Bn KRRC entered France was March 30th 1916. Therefore it does seem likely he served with them from their inception at Green Park in London in August 1915. They served with the 3rd Division as the pioneer battalion, so it would be necessary to see their war diary to establish where they were at any time. The card indicated that his qualification for his medals was held on the Medal Roll numbered OFF/159 page 158. This was the roll for officers of the Leicestershire Regiment (National Archives Catalogue reference WO 329/2202 Leicestershire Regiment officers: medal rolls OFF/159. Pages 1-230, 1A-4A and 1C-30C. British War Medal and Victory Medal." Page 158. The cross by the roll number and the rank of 2nd Lieut indicated the rank to be impressed on the medals. His medal qualification was also recorded on R&F (Rank and File) Medal Roll M/101 B43 page 5276 which was probably a KRRC medal roll. He qualified for the Victory Medal and the British War Medal which were ordered from the mint at Woolwich on 13.6. 1922. He was commissioned on 26.6.18. Officers had to apply for their campaign medals after the war and the reverse of the medal card (not shown on TNA downloads) showed he returned his application on May 25th 1922 from an address at 29 Falmouth Road, Trinity Square, London SE.
Officers did not have regimental numbers in the First World War, which is why no new number was indicated.
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Paul
Date: Friday 8th October 2010 at 8:50 PM

Dear Alan

Thank you so much for taking the time to provide such a quick and comprehensive response, it really is appreciated. I have told my father and we are already planning the trip to Kew as the knowledge that the records may have survived after all has been a real boost, but we do accept that we could be disappointed of course.

The only item that my father is uncertain about is that it was never mentioned that his father returned to England for training . Would he definitely (as far as you know) have trained in England or were there field commissions?

Two other items if I may? His medal card has a number of additional references, one of which is NW/3/9642, the other something like IVX/9145d. Do these mean anything at all?

Finally. I was searching the National Archives again this evening and unexpectedly came across a second medal card for Edward whilst he was an acting serjeant which applies to his MM. This has two references 'Registered Paper 68/121/345' and 'Schedule Number 114104'. Do these mean anything relevant to our searches at all?

Coincidentally my father had sent a cheque the the BLA earlier this week, but we will now be sending a second!

Thank you so much.

Kind regards

Paul
Reply from: Alan Greveson
Date: Friday 8th October 2010 at 9:56 PM

Dear Paul,
The majority of Officer Cadets were trained in the UK and certainly by 1918 their training had become uniform, so in theory attendance at a school was compulsory before being commissioned. See
http://www.1914-1918.net/training_officers.htm
At the back of my mind there is some recollection of officer schools in France, but they may have been for refresher training in developing tactics.
The markings on the medal card will not take your research any further. IVX/9145d appears to be the order number for the Victory and British War Medals and NW/3/9642 is probably a despatch reference. Most soldiers' medals were batch-produced by Medal Roll page number but officer's medals were ordered as one-offs, so the ordering process was referenced on their cards.
I searched the Ancestry website for the MM Medal Card but couldn't find one. The references 'Registered Paper 68/121/345' and 'Schedule Number 114104' are administrative and won't help in the search. There may be a reference that looks like LG with a date or a number. That refers to the issue of the London Gazette in which the award was published but you now have that, so again there is no further information provided by the card.
If you go to Kew allow plenty of time to read the war diary (you will need to be a registered reader for access to that so take some photo ID and proof of address with you).
Kind regards,
Alan
Reply from: Paul
Date: Friday 8th October 2010 at 11:42 PM

Thanks again Alan

The link to the list I found is at:
http://www.hut-six.co.uk/GreatWar/KRRC/King'sRoyalRifleCorps_R.html
(I had to change the letter after the underscore on the right as I could only find A and C surname lists so tried changing it to R it and it worked).

About a third of the way down are the two entries. Click on the link to the right of the list and it takes you to the National Archives page where I bought the medal cards (£2 each)

47983 is the MM
47985 is the card with the victory and war medals and the references you explain above.
I don't expect another response as you have done more than enough already - just sent for completeness as I found the list by chance.

Thanks for the tip about Kew. Have a good weekend

Kind regards

Paul


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